Delete please.

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Delete please.

Postby MadDogT994 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 9:11 pm

Delete please.
Last edited by MadDogT994 on Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:16 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby RiderxBoys » Wed Apr 23, 2014 9:58 pm

No, I think it still will be a source of tension for players due to the fact that many current players on our server have been long-time VC members. Giving it to some and not others, especially in light of clan fairness and all that, may cause some jealousy and ill-will. There's not really a need to return this rank, since our intake of new players isn't all that huge.

Though I could see its use on VC, I think it's better to just leave this rank with the rest of VC history.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby MadDogT994 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:07 pm

It has nothing to do with clans at all but the individual player and length of time on the server has never been part of it so... kinda need to hear a better argument against it to change my mind.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby OzzyRaptor » Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:50 pm

I don't know, I like the idea, but there are a lot of negatives. Unless people really want it back, I think it just adds to much drama.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby MadDogT994 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:52 pm

I really don't get it, what are these negatives and tension you guys are referring to?

EDIT: Not trying to be an @$$, I just really don't see the problems you (Ozzy & Rider) are seeing.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby OzzyRaptor » Wed Apr 23, 2014 10:55 pm

MadDogT994 wrote:I really don't get it, what are these negatives and tension you guys are referring to?

It just is another thing ryan has to worry about and the residents aren't kept up to date then people start to get upset.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby RiderxBoys » Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:28 pm

MadDogT994 wrote:I really don't get it, what are these negatives and tension you guys are referring to?

EDIT: Not trying to be an @$$, I just really don't see the problems you (Ozzy & Rider) are seeing.


OK, well, let's just take a purely hypothetical example.

Persons A and B have both been playing VC for 2+ years. Both are generally helpful, though they are not perfect and have both gotten into a little bit of drama. Nothing major though. For some reason or other, Person A is selected to be a resident and Person B isn't. As Person B, wouldn't you be at least somewhat jealous as to why a person who is so similar to you got to be Resident while you aren't?

That is, of course, only one example. And it may not ever happen. Person B may be totally cool with this, but I think it's a possibility that they would be jealous.

Also, given how many players who play right now would be good candidates for residents, I have no idea how the staff of VC would create a program that differentiates the very best from the others. Resident is a select group, and nobody who plays on the server is perfect (if they were, they'd be mods by now).

The larger argument here is all the work on the part of the staff to decide what makes a person worthy of the [R] and its perks. This is not to say that there shouldn't be a short list of people the staff considers for the next batch of T-Mods, but it would be better to keep such a list private and small.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby Tautochrone » Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:37 pm

It's a bad idea for the same reasons why leaving anything else up to "moderator discretion" is a bad idea.

Edit: By the way...this is the most active The Order has been in quite some time lmao
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby MadDogT994 » Wed Apr 23, 2014 11:39 pm

Well it's never come up in the past that a player got the Resident rank but his near twin didn't so... no, I really don't think that would happen. It's always been part of the "system" that if you believe you deserve the rank, then you actually don't. Same thing with Mods. As I said before, time played on VC wouldn't mean squat for Residency, and being "generally helpful" isn't Resident material either. The person has to stand out.

As for those people would already be Mods, that's a fallacy in logic as there hasn't been a new Mod since, well I can't remember who the "newest" Mod is now... but there have been a number of players who would have been good at the job join or continue to play on the server.

Besides, I would imagine that drama of any kind would preclude someone from qualifying for consideration anyway so... there's your select group too.

EDIT: The Order may not be on the forums much as a group, but I've seen at least one other member online every time I log in so... :P

EDIT2: I think you gents are focusing too much on what "could" go wrong and what "might" happen, and not looking at the benefits of recognizing those players who have put their time and effort into doing what they can to benefit the server overall. As a former Resident myself, it felt pretty darn good to log in one day and see that gray [R] next to my name.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby RiderxBoys » Thu Apr 24, 2014 12:37 am

MadDogT994 wrote:As a former Resident myself, it felt pretty darn good to log in one day and see that gray [R] next to my name.


And when we saw how minimuffin retained his [R] despite his drama, all us non-residents were left wondering why/how
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby MadDogT994 » Thu Apr 24, 2014 2:25 am

I don't believe minimuffin was ever a Resident... and if he was, it was long before his descent into madness.

Whatever, I certainly didn't expect this amount of pushback on a simple idea, but if it's not what the people want then it's not what the people want. Far be it for me to want to recognize the efforts of others, but no, let's let the actions of players 2 years past prevent progress.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby Tautochrone » Thu Apr 24, 2014 2:38 am

It has no benefits, only downsides.

It's always been part of the "system" that if you believe you deserve the rank, then you actually don't. Same thing with Mods. As I said before, time played on VC wouldn't mean squat for Residency, and being "generally helpful" isn't Resident material either. The person has to stand out.


So you can't talk about wanting it...if you have it you should always say you don't deserve it (saying otherwise would be un-residently) and it's based on neither time spent on the server nor how well you behave.

What else is there besides it being an overall popularity contest? Number of blocks placed? Number of mobs killed in spawn?

There's no point. Even when we had it, it was widely regardless as a pointless/meaningless rank.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby MadDogT994 » Thu Apr 24, 2014 2:50 am

It was a badge of honor that meant the player was actively engaged in the server and helped players out, answering questions or telling them where to find open land. It meant something at one point and it had very little to do with in-game performance such as blocks placed or mobs killed. It was a reflection of the players personality and how much they showed their interest in the server.

Saying that if you think you deserve it then you don't doesn't mean just the superficial "Oh, I don't deserve this rank, I didn't do anything" bullshit that anyone can see right through. It was a general attitude of, "Ok, thanks for the rank, I'm going to go back to doing what I was to get it in the first place, but thanks, really." A Resident was supposed to be the paragon of values that VC used to have.

Quite frankly, you weren't around in the heyday of this server and really don't have a clue what it was like to play here and be a part of something like the old community. I keep seeing the posts about "getting back to v3" and "regaining the community from v3" but when stuff like this, stuff directly from v3 that improved the community and gave people something to strive toward gets shot down, it's really very disheartening.

If you don't think it has benefits, well to be completely frank, I really don't see you ever achieving the rank Tauto so what does it really matter? I don't see myself getting it either, so don't think that's motivation here at all. What I do see though is players like Birdbrainf4 actively trying to make this server a better place and continually being shot down for their efforts or given absolutely no recognition at all. There are players who would see the rank of Resident for what it is meant to be and take pride in knowing that their efforts have not gone unnoticed.

I'm done ranting about this though, it seems clear to me that the community that we have right now just isn't willing or able to make this kind of idea work. There's too much drama, too much "me me me" attitude, and much too much blood in the water for the voices of VC to speak out.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby piethingey » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:10 am

I wasn't on when [R] Resident was brought to life in V3, but I remember seeing a few on V4. I say if we do reward [R] to people they must have done something large to the server.

What I mean is you should have been playing on VC from V2 to early V3, and have done something to advance the server forwards (i.e. Have donated, have coded the server, have helped players on the server constantly, former mod, helped build roads, etc., etc...)

I feel like the first requirement chops off most people, the second part could turn into a popularity contest though.
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Re: Discuggestion*: Bringing Back [R] Resident?

Postby MadDogT994 » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:15 am

EDIT: Not worth repeating myself.
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Re: Forget it - delete

Postby Tautochrone » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:19 am

I don't understand why you ask us for our thoughts and opinions and then dismiss and insult the community when they don't agree with yours.
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Re: Delete please.

Postby MadDogT994 » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:22 am

How have I dismissed or insulted the community in any part of what I said?

By saying this place is full of drama, bad blood, old grudges and a "me me me" attitude? That's not insulting, it's a fact, one that you've pointed out plenty of times yourself, so please don't play the hypocrite Tauto.


I asked for thoughts and discussion about the idea, not derision and getting "shot down" for posting an idea. There's a way to have a discussion, and even a way to have an argument, without putting it down completely. This thread is a good example of how not to do it.
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Re: Delete please.

Postby MrPalmer » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:35 am

Such thread. Much wow. Very drama.

+1 For no resident. This thread proves that it's not a popular idea.
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Re: Delete please.

Postby Tautochrone » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:36 am

MadDogT994 wrote:How have I dismissed or insulted the community in any part of what I said?


You pretty much said that anyone that wasn't here during v3 has no idea what they're talking about.

I asked for thoughts and discussion about the idea, not derision and getting "shot down" for posting an idea. There's a way to have a discussion, and even a way to have an argument, without putting it down completely. This thread is a good example of how not to do it.


You asked if it was worth bringing back (I'd quote it but you went on a hissy-fit delete-fest). We said no. You asked why we felt that way. We told you why we felt that way. You got angry and said (to summarize) well of course we don't like it because we weren't here when it was awesome so we don't know what we're talking about and we're all clearly incapable of making something like this work. <---That's the only derision in this thread. Nobody was mocking or insulting you. We were just answering your question literally asking for our thoughts on bringing the rank back.
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Re: Delete please.

Postby MadDogT994 » Thu Apr 24, 2014 3:45 am

The arguments presented were completely hypothetical and overblown to boot, not based on any kind of fact and really only served to enforce my point about the attitudes of the community on VC now not being conducive to making the Resident system work again.


I only say that you don't know what you're talking about because, well, you really, honestly, 100% do not. It's not meant to be insulting and really you shouldn't be insulted by a simple fact. You were not around for the Resident system and only saw the dwindling remnants of the system in its death spiral after Void stopped giving a crap. What you saw and what you have experience with is not the Resident system, but a twisted version where many players held the rank but stopped earning it long before.

Call it a "hissy-fit delete-fest" to you and yours if you like, but don't insult me by doing so where I can read it. If I choose to delete my own posts then that's my decision to make.

Like it or not, this is no longer worth discussing, so let's all walk away and wait for a Mod to clean it up, yes? My mind is unchanged about the benefits of Resident, and I can live with that.
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